H

hjlbx

List of current issues
System and $ Volume are not TRIMMED.
Steps taken, but have been unsuccessful?
Tried everything I could find on-line; no fix.
1. Clean install Windows
2. System is never Trimmed
3. Volume is never Trimmed

Is this how Windows 8.1 SSD TRIM is supposed to work (it doesn't matter if use built-in scheduled or custom task - I use custom task so schedule is turned off).

Capture.PNG
 

DracusNarcrym

Level 19
Verified
Hey, @hjlbx, I started a conversation with you and posted the first message with some nice information. I'm going to transfer it here as well, though, for all people to see.

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Try the following command:
Code:
fsutil behavior query DisableDeleteNotify
  • If the above command returns DisableDeleteNotify = 0 then the Trim command is fully enabled and properly operating in Windows
  • If the above command returns DisableDeleteNotify = 1 then the Trim command is disabled and it's not properly operating in Windows
If the command returns DisableDeleteNotify = 0 then you will not need to perform any other task.
Windows is silently trimming your SSD as required.

The "Optimize Drives" module in Windows 8/8.1 (as well as Windows 10 apparently) seems to have issues regarding the "Needs optimization" flag for SSD partitions, since Windows is actually performing the trimming tasks in the background and they do not require user input.

As such, I believe that there is no reason to be alarmed as this issue is merely a bug/glitch in "Optimize Drives" which has seemingly been overlooked by Microsoft so far, who have not released a patch for this issue as of yet.

I hope this clears up the situation a bit. :p
 
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Hangtooth

Level 5
There are two solutions if you want to get rid of the hidden reserved system partition that is not being TRIMmed:

ONE - Prevent it from being created on a fresh install

Not sure if it's what you are talking about, but it *is* possible to keep the hidden system reserved partition from being created on a clean install:

"If you don’t want this partition on your drive, the ideal thing to do is prevent it from being created in the first place. Rather than create a new partition in unallocated space from within the Windows installer, you can create a new partition consuming all the unallocated space with another disk-partitioning tool. Point the Windows installer at the partition you created and Windows will happily continue — it won’t attempt to resize your partition and create a System Reserved partition. The Windows installer will accept that there’s no room for System Reserved partition and install Windows onto a single partition. Bear in mind that you’re not saving an entire 100 MB or 350 MB by doing this, as the boot files will instead be installed on the main system partition."

and

"To stop the reserved space from being created from the gui you can:

Select create new partition (this will create reserve + install partition) Delete 2nd partition (leaving only the reserve) Highlight the reserved partition and then click expand (use the rest of the disk) Click next to complete installation
This is how we would do it at work because a) I hated that partition b) it would cause problems for imaging thousands of laptops/desktops depending on which imaging tool we would use."

Source: What is the System Reserved Partition and Can You Delete It?

OR

TWO - Move the boot files from the reserved system partition to C: so you can then delete and merge the hidden partition back into C:

Using EasyBCD free to move the files: Bootmgr - Move to C:\ with EasyBCD - Windows 7 Help Forums

Once it now boots from C: as it should after moving the system files, you can then use your fave partitioning tool to delete the reserved system partition and merge it into the full SSD partition.

I have done this both ways in the past with Windows 10 (should work for 8 and 7 too), and I hope this helps, as I am not 100% sure I understood your question =)

I end up with: 2015-12-29 15_08_44-Optimize Drives.jpg

Note that my SSD is all one happy unit, no hidden partitions to worry about and I trim the whole thing manually once a week (as recommended by intel) with the intel SSD Toolbox, as it's an intel SSD. I just fresh installed again last night, thanks to installing shadow defender to 'try it out' and breaking my install =) LOL the irony, virtualizing software breaking my install because I wasn't running virtualizing software...

(In case you wonder the picture above displays 1 boot SSD, 2 HDDs and a USB Stick)
 
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DracusNarcrym

Level 19
Verified
@Hangtooth I think you pretty much completed the answer to this little riddle. :p
As I can see in your screenshot of "Optimize Drives", your System partition is also flagged as "Needs optimization", however according to my findings, that flag cannot be modified, due to an internal glitch of the "Optimize Drives" feature.

@hjlbx Those extra pesky partitions seem to be some sort of reserved system partitions, which are remnants of the original, factory Windows installation that was shipped with @hjlbx's machine. (@hjlbx, correct me if I'm wrong on this one)
The best solution to this bugger would be to remove those pesky partitions once and for all, just like @Hangtooth described. :D
 

Hangtooth

Level 5
As I can see in your screenshot of "Optimize Drives", your System partition is also flagged as "Needs optimization", however according to my findings, that flag cannot be modified, due to an internal glitch of the "Optimize Drives" feature.
Hah I just saw that too and forced a manual trim on the SSD through the interface just now and the result is:

2015-12-29 15_36_51-Optimize Drives.jpg

Too funny, it's as if you read my mind! Forcing a windows trim switched the flag but I have never checked if an auto trim would do that. I trimmed first with the intel toolbox and windows refused to accept the fact that it was trimmed so had to do it with the windows tool.
 
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DracusNarcrym

Level 19
Verified
Too funny, it's as if you read my mind! Forcing a windows trim switched the flag but I have never checked if an auto trim would do that. I trimmed first with the intel toolbox and windows refused to accept the fact that it was trimmed so had to do it with the windows tool.
Exactly! But the thing is, Windows is also supposed to incrementally trim your SSDs automatically and silently in the background! (this is a confirmed feature in Windows 8/8.1 and Windows 10) But why doesn't Optimize Drives actually detect the trimming performed by Windows in the background? Or, actually, why doesn't it detect trimming by any other application, like you explained? (e.g. Intel Toolbox)

I guess Optimize Drives needs some... optimization. :D
 

Hangtooth

Level 5
Yes, I just turned off the auto-optimization myself, I didn't even realize it was on by default until i compared my settings to @hjlbx 's

I much prefer to run the Intel SSD Toolbox, I highly doubt it works on other manufacturer drives. I bought an Intel SSD at the time a few years back as they were reputably the most reliable. It's been great so far: The tool is nifty too:

2015-12-29 15_52_04-Intel® Solid-State Drive Toolbox.jpg

I hope our answers helped, @hjlbx , If it's a fresh install I'd just start again and keep the partition(s) from being made at install time. The EasyBCD tool worked great, but I feel safer when I am not forcing Windows to do things =)

I even like their System Tuner to help me ensure I have the right settings to use SSD + HDD mixed system:

2015-12-29 15_57_07-Intel® Solid-State Drive Toolbox.jpg
 
H

hjlbx

OEM Windows OS crapware... !!

This is gonna take some time and effort.

Too much infos to sort out from too many sources, but once again, I can only find solid infos at MalwareTips !

Why don't that surprise me. :cool:
 

DracusNarcrym

Level 19
Verified
OEM Windows OS crapware... !!

This is gonna take some time and effort.

Too much infos to sort out from too many sources, but once again, I can only find solid infos at MalwareTips !

Why don't that surprise me. :cool:
MalwareTips is the ►♕KING♕◄ :D

Seriously now, I hope the above information is adequate to at least figure out what's going on in your system.
I hope that OEM Windows is to blame for all the fuss. :p
 
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Hangtooth

Level 5
Just for you @hjlbx :

2016-01-10 07_31_06-Optimize Drives.jpg

I rebuilt my system yesterday (because I had a minor problem and it's faster to backup and reinstall than it is to use an image at this point) and I did an experiment just for you. I let Windows install on the unformatted SSD instead of the formatted SSD like I usually do and you can see the result. The hidden system partition is back.

Remember, easiest way to avoid this on install of Windows is to fully format the SSD into one complete unit with no unformatted space, and the installer will not create this system partition.

I honestly don't know which is more stable, Windows 10 with or without the hidden system partition. At least we can choose!
 

DracusNarcrym

Level 19
Verified
I'd personally go without the hidden partition.

If it is for system repair purposes only, then I guess any above-average user can stick to backing up their computer manually, without relying on Windows' funky repair/restore partitions.
 
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