Joined
Jun 2, 2018
Messages
96
Operating System
Windows 10
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Windows Defender
#1
hi

I was recently hardening my mum's computer and installed NVT ERP and OSA... Why did I ever thought ERP was a good idea?
This is a WhatsApp conversation: She had a problem with ERP alerting for something today, so I was asking for her to copy the file for me that ERP alerted of, and she couldn't find it. I told her the path is right there in the message, just copy it. She proceeds to open a windows search for the file. I was again telling her where it was, writing the path to it myself this time. She get's silent for a while. Suddenly she starts listing file extensions. I was like, wtf? She says it's not there and sends me a picture of the search that still runs. She asks for me to come take a look. (Remote control) Turns out she was going through all folders of the disk to list me the file extensions. :X3:

We should have a Mum-Off to see whos mum is more tech-savvy!


I'm actually at a loss now. I think OSA can stay, but ERP has to go definitely. It doesn't protect her. I also believe the windows firewall is not enough in this case. Any suggestions?
 

Deletedmessiah

Level 21
Verified
Joined
Jan 16, 2017
Messages
1,010
Operating System
Windows 8.1
#2
ERP is not suitable for non tech savvy people. OSArmor is suitable for her so keep it. If she is, what AV she's using? If the AV has firewall built in then no need for a separate firewall. If not, then try using WFC or simplewall by henrypp. There is also modified tinywall installer to work in newer Windows builds, not sure if I should recommend this but you can find more information on wilders if you look.
 

CMLew

Level 23
Verified
Joined
Oct 30, 2015
Messages
1,213
Operating System
Windows 10
Antivirus
#3
hi

I was recently hardening my mum's computer and installed NVT ERP and OSA... Why did I ever thought ERP was a good idea?
This is a WhatsApp conversation: She had a problem with ERP alerting for something today, so I was asking for her to copy the file for me that ERP alerted of, and she couldn't find it. I told her the path is right there in the message, just copy it. She proceeds to open a windows search for the file. I was again telling her where it was, writing the path to it myself this time. She get's silent for a while. Suddenly she starts listing file extensions. I was like, wtf? She says it's not there and sends me a picture of the search that still runs. She asks for me to come take a look. (Remote control) Turns out she was going through all folders of the disk to list me the file extensions. :X3:

We should have a Mum-Off to see whos mum is more tech-savvy!


I'm actually at a loss now. I think OSA can stay, but ERP has to go definitely. It doesn't protect her. I also believe the windows firewall is not enough in this case. Any suggestions?
Obviously you over-estimate your own judgement.
Installing security for family use isn't as simple as you thought. it needs to be as user-friendly as it could be.
Thats what I do.
I install NVT-ERP and EAM and set it lockdown. Then create LUA for my family to login and surf.
 

upnorth

Level 26
Content Creator
Verified
Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Messages
1,527
#4
ERP gives you full control on every single application that is installed\executed in the system and is more for advanced users.

OSArmor is for beginner users (but also for experts) with pre-built rules that requires 0 configuration and adds an additional (solid) layer of defense.
@NoVirusThanks is the developer.
 
Joined
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Messages
96
Operating System
Windows 10
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Windows Defender
#5
CMLew: I know. :LOL: I was going to talk about my reverse Dunning-Kruger bias but couldn't compile a funny sentence. So removed it.
What's EAM and LUA? Is EAM Eset? I had Eset before and it was too

Deletedmessiah: I only use Windows Defender everywhere. And as a consequence Windows Firewall. Both good programs. FOR ME
Uuuuh! I am definitely going to use WFC! Awesome! Thanks! I always hated windows firewall's outbound connection handling and inability to add rules to it as simply as adding inbound rules. Wth is wrong with microsoft?
 

Deletedmessiah

Level 21
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Messages
1,010
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Windows 8.1
#7
CMLew: I know. :LOL: I was going to talk about my reverse Dunning-Kruger bias but couldn't compile a funny sentence. So removed it.
What's EAM and LUA? Is EAM Eset? I had Eset before and it was too

Deletedmessiah: I only use Windows Defender everywhere. And as a consequence Windows Firewall. Both good programs. FOR ME
Uuuuh! I am definitely going to use WFC! Awesome! Thanks! I always hated windows firewall's outbound connection handling and inability to add rules to it as simply as adding inbound rules. Wth is wrong with microsoft?
I agree. If there was outbound alert and if third party apps weren't allowed to just create rules as they please, Windows Firewall would be enough. I don't know why MS decided to exclude such important options in the Firewall.
 
Joined
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Messages
96
Operating System
Windows 10
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Windows Defender
#8
Ok I tested WFC... it's apparently EOL now or soon: Dev goes to Malwarebytes and you can't register/donate anymore to get notifications unlocked. So it's useless. :(

Harlan: Oh, I never thought of LUA before. Of course! I never used LUA ever, though. I don't know how to work without admin rights yet. I google it.
I would use EmsiSoft Anti-MalWare if it was free. And it should be something that is secure and set-and-forget.
Any good, free, automatic alternative that allows windows updates to be made?
 

Umbra

Level 85
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Joined
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Messages
18,730
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#10
Then the only choice right now might be simplewall by henrypp. I'm using it now and its working without issues. But if you try, see if its buggy for you or not.
or start to learn how to make rules, i know it is a hassle but you don't get skills by letting others do your job.
 

oldschool

Level 17
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Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
810
Operating System
Windows 10
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Cylance
#11
... There is also modified tinywall installer to work in newer Windows builds, not sure if I should recommend this but you can find more information on wilders if you look.
Yes, I used it to get TinyWall back on my machine after the April update. It works fine! It has no notifications but is very user friendly since if something is not working you may use Learning Mode. Or, very easy to whitelist - by executable, by process, or by window. I am pretty much a casual user and it works great for me - blocks all outbound except those needed by Windows and user. You may find it here: Windows 10 Privacy Guide - Spring Creators Update this guy simply added a modified installer. @NulFunction - if your mom can find the program files she can use TinyWall. Add OsArmor and VoodooShield Free to WD and she may be all set! These apps are all appropriate for casual users.
 

oldschool

Level 17
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Joined
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Messages
810
Operating System
Windows 10
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Cylance
#15
Isn't TinyWall no longer developed? Last update 10.03.2016
You'll notice the website copyright extends to 2017. While Windows 10 has continued to change through all of its updates, WF has remained a constant for some years - according to what I have read. It works without any bugs that I have found. I too was concerned that the developer has been dormant on some forums. It is a simple program and if all known bugs have been dealt with - that may explain why it hasn't been updated. Will MS update its firewall? What will the future hold? Who knows? I use TinyWall and others do to - for now.
 

CMLew

Level 23
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Oct 30, 2015
Messages
1,213
Operating System
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#17
Ok I tested WFC... it's apparently EOL now or soon: Dev goes to Malwarebytes and you can't register/donate anymore to get notifications unlocked. So it's useless. :(

Harlan: Oh, I never thought of LUA before. Of course! I never used LUA ever, though. I don't know how to work without admin rights yet. I google it.
I would use EmsiSoft Anti-MalWare if it was free. And it should be something that is secure and set-and-forget.
Any good, free, automatic alternative that allows windows updates to be made?
That is the purpose of LUA. You don't allow your family to touch admin rights. If they cant means they cant even if they were frustrated. Same for WFC, you don't allow them to decide what connection to connect or block. Which is why you should lock them down. Thats where LUA excels in.
 
Joined
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Messages
96
Operating System
Windows 10
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Windows Defender
#18
But I don't really want to remote control their devices every day to allow a new game they play or whatever... I need more proactive things.

I tried Simplewall for my PC now. It's pretty good. Took me a while to get Windows Update running again, but meh.
If TinyWall is better I'll change to it and then add it to her computer and tell her to only add a program/game if it definitely needs internet to function.
 

Spawn

Administrator
MalwareTips Team
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Messages
17,570
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#20
Well that was clever.

It's always a good idea to test the software out and make your own judgement, before installing for someone with less computer security expertise.

I tend to stay with Install & forget security. It's generally better for all computer users, and you can get more work done.

Less interactions = less things going wrong.