Troubleshoot Buy a better processor than the i7-7700.

[eonline]

Briefly explain your current issue(s)

No.

Steps taken to resolve, but have been unsuccessful

No.

Hi, I'm thinking of buying a new processor that's better than the i7-7700. My budget is 100 to $500. If anyone can help me very grateful in advance. Best regards.

 

[Vasudev]

@Emanuel Tomasin For future reference only, next time look at CPU silicon lottery if you want the CPU to last many years and Overclock higher say 4.5GHz-5.1GHz provided your ambient temps are under 27C and you're using Air/AiO/H20 cooling. Delid and Pre-binned CPU are always great.

 

[Digerati]

Delid and Pre-binned CPU are always great.

And a great way to void a warranty. Delidding and overclocking do NOT, in any way increase the expected life expectancy of the processor.

It should also be noted that, while proper cooling is critically essential, lower temperatures is NOT automatically better. Electronics is designed to operate within a specific operating temperature range. If the CPU sits comfortably within that range, this is just fine. So a CPU running at 25°C, for example does NOT offer better performance, is NOT more stable, and does NOT have a longer life expectancy than the CPU running at 50 or even 55°C.

Note too that the CPU is not the only heat sensitive device in a computer that affects stability. And note it is the case's responsibility to ensure there is enough air flow across all those sensitive components. And it is the user's responsibility to ensure case cooling is properly configured and adequate to create the necessary flow and . And the CPU cooler need only toss the CPU's heat into that flow.

I am not saying don't overclock. I am just saying do your homework and know what you are getting into.

 

[Quassar]

Lol your CPU is so far enought to play even 3d render.... your card is potato... 730 meh

You have CPU for 300$ and you put to these gtx730 which cost 70$ and you are wonder why your games have problem work. just LAWL xDDDD

Colect money and buy something from mid-hght range like GTX 1070 or GTX 1080... later buy same ram bone to get 16GB rams than you can play in most lates game on ultra setings with out any problem if you have 1900x1400 resolution.

 

[Vasudev]

And a great way to void a warranty. Delidding and overclocking do NOT, in any way increase the expected life expectancy of the processor.

It should also be noted that, while proper cooling is critically essential, lower temperatures is NOT automatically better. Electronics is designed to operate within a specific operating temperature range. If the CPU sits comfortably within that range, this is just fine. So a CPU running at 25°C, for example does NOT offer better performance, is NOT more stable, and does NOT have a longer life expectancy than the CPU running at 50 or even 55°C.

Silicon lottery does give you a 1 yr. warranty.
I'm really confused what you mean by this "So a CPU running at 25°C, for example does NOT offer better performance, is NOT more stable, and does NOT have a longer life expectancy than the CPU running at 50 or even 55°C."
Lesser temps means you can get more turbo boost clocks running for longest duration possible w/o throttling. I'm unsure why you say Lower temps for CPU impact its stability in the long run. Delids are necessary when you're overclocking to get lower temps which allows more thermal headroom to get more speed out of the chip.
I have room temps above 30-40C during summers and every degree of temp reduced counts.

 

[Digerati]

Lesser temps means you can get more turbo boost clocks running for longest duration possible w/o throttling.

NO! You skipped the most important part of my comment. If you keep your maximum temps "comfortably" within the processor's specified normal operating temperature ranges - as I said above - it does not matter is the CPU is reaching 55°C, or 25°C. 55°C is still well below the threshold it will start to throttle back in speeds.

I'm unsure why you say Lower temps for CPU impact its stability in the long run.

I didn't say that.

I said the opposite of that. I specifically said a CPU is NOT more stable at 25° than it is at 55°C. And that is because 55°C is still well within the CPU's normal operating range and well below it's thermal limits. Point being, there is still plenty of your desired "thermal headroom" left if running at 55° to keep it from throttling back.

I have room temps above 30-40C during summers and every degree of temp reduced counts.

Of course ambient temps count. But that has nothing to do with what I said.

But to that, it is important to note it is impossible to cool anything below the ambient temperature with conventional (fan) cooling. So if your room is 40°, the best you can do is blow 40° air on your processor. Your processor is not living flesh. It is not affected by "chill factors". To get cooler than the ambient temp, you must use alternative cooling solutions that involve refrigeration or thermoelectric (Peltier) principles.

Delids are necessary when you're overclocking to get lower temps which allows more thermal headroom to get more speed out of the chip.

Deliding is not necessary when overclocking. It is but one trick some users use when overclocking, but it certainly is not "necessary".

Just to reiterate my point - AS LONG AS you maintain your processor's peak temperatures well within its specified normal operating temperature range, it does not matter if that peak temperature is 25°C, 45°C or even 55°C. The lower temps will NOT improve stability, performance or longevity of the processor. All that 25°C gives you is bragging rights.

 

[Vasudev]

NO! You skipped the most important part of my comment. If you keep your maximum temps "comfortably" within the processor's specified normal operating temperature ranges - as I said above - it does not matter is the CPU is reaching 55°C, or 25°C. 55°C is still well below the threshold it will start to throttle back in speeds.
I didn't say that.

I said the opposite of that. I specifically said a CPU is NOT more stable at 25° than it is at 55°C. And that is because 55°C is still well within the CPU's normal operating range and well below it's thermal limits. Point being, there is still plenty of your desired "thermal headroom" left if running at 55° to keep it from throttling back.
Of course ambient temps count. But that has nothing to do with what I said.

But to that, it is important to note it is impossible to cool anything below the ambient temperature with conventional (fan) cooling. So if your room is 40°, the best you can do is blow 40° air on your processor. Your processor is not living flesh. It is not affected by "chill factors". To get cooler than the ambient temp, you must use alternative cooling solutions that involve refrigeration or thermoelectric (Peltier) principles.
Deliding is not necessary when overclocking. It is but one trick some users use when overclocking, but it certainly is not "necessary".

Just to reiterate my point - AS LONG AS you maintain your processor's peak temperatures well within its specified normal operating temperature range, it does not matter if that peak temperature is 25°C, 45°C or even 55°C. The lower temps will NOT improve stability, performance or longevity of the processor. All that 25°C gives you is bragging rights.

Should have made those points clear earlier to avoid the confusion.
I thought you were getting on my nerves purposely.

 

[Digerati]

I am not a forum troll seeking to create arguments. I am actually a very concerned forum participant who happens to be a certified master electronics technician with decades of personal experience (see the link under About in my profile) with the primary goal of ensuring technical facts about electronics are presented in these technical discussions. Sadly, rumors, myths, misconceptions, and out-and-out falsehoods abound across the Internet - especially when it comes to personal computers which some don't seem understand are electronics too. Thus, as electronics, they must comply with the same Laws of Physics as all other electronics do.

And "cooler is better" is one of those common misconceptions. Properly cooled is essential. But cooler still is not automatically better - except perhaps for "bragging rights".

 

[CMLew]

I am not a forum troll seeking to create arguments. I am actually a very concerned forum participant who happens to be a certified master electronics technician with decades of personal experience (see the link under About in my profile) with the primary goal of ensuring technical facts about electronics are presented in these technical discussions. Sadly, rumors, myths, misconceptions, and out-and-out falsehoods abound across the Internet - especially when it comes to personal computers which some don't seem understand are electronics too. Thus, as electronics, they must comply with the same Laws of Physics as all other electronics do.

And "cooler is better" is one of those common misconceptions. Properly cooled is essential. But cooler still is not automatically better - except perhaps for "bragging rights".

Well I agree. Cooler doesn't mean better.

 

[Vasudev]

I am not a forum troll seeking to create arguments. I am actually a very concerned forum participant who happens to be a certified master electronics technician with decades of personal experience (see the link under About in my profile) with the primary goal of ensuring technical facts about electronics are presented in these technical discussions. Sadly, rumors, myths, misconceptions, and out-and-out falsehoods abound across the Internet - especially when it comes to personal computers which some don't seem understand are electronics too. Thus, as electronics, they must comply with the same Laws of Physics as all other electronics do.

And "cooler is better" is one of those common misconceptions. Properly cooled is essential. But cooler still is not automatically better - except perhaps for "bragging rights".

I know that you're a Certified Pro but I'm a Pro with no HW certification that's only the difference.
By today's standards Instead of Properly Cooled most of them go by the buzzword Optimal Cooling which is kind of disappointing. Although I prefer Damn Properly Cooled hardware instead of resorting to firmware based throttling to keep temps down thereby killing user experience.

 

[Digerati]

I know that you're a Certified Pro but I'm a Pro with no HW certification that's only the difference.

That does not mean jack for either of us.

The point I was making is I do have some considerable expertise in electronics hardware due to my degrees, certifications and decades working "in the field" professionally as an electronics technician. No brag - just fact And while the last 20+ years have been focused on computer hardware and networking (including 10 years as a hardware guy in a large software development company that supported secure government networks), I don't pretend for a second that I am a "Windows" expert or a "Pro" at programming or "software" code development. This is true even though one of my "other hats" in that development company was as an alpha and beta tester for our software.

IT is industries within industries. No way anyone is an expert in all areas. One of the beauties of forums like this is they bring members with all sorts of expertise from many areas within IT together so we can all share and learn from our collective expertise and experiences.

If this site allowed signatures, you would see, as noted here in the last line of my signature that heat is something I have taken a particular interest in.

Although I prefer Damn Properly Cooled hardware instead of resorting to firmware based throttling to keep temps down thereby killing user experience.

I agree 100% with you on this!

Many people, newbies and more experienced alike, don't seem to understand, as I noted above, it is the case's responsibility to provide an adequate supply of cool air through the case. And it is the user's responsibility to ensure the case is doing just that. If the CPU temperatures and temps within the case have reached that threshold that causes the BIOS (firmware) to trigger those thermal protection features, the user has failed to do his or her job of configuring case cooling. They either need to add more fans, replace the fans with higher capacity (more CFM) fans, or replace the case with one that supports better cooling options.

the buzzword Optimal Cooling which is kind of disappointing.

You say "buzzword", I say "marketing hype". Either way, you are right; it is disappointing because, like most marketing hype, it is misleading at best, totally false at worst.

Well I agree. Cooler doesn't mean better.

Well, conditionally! If the CPU is pushing 90°C, 60°C is better. But if the CPU is running at 50°C, that is comfortably within the acceptable operating range so 30°C is not any better.

All in all, I think we are on the same page here!