Need Help My laptop has gone mental

Discussion in 'Hardware - Questions & Help' started by Weebarra, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. frogboy

    frogboy Level 61
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  2. Weebarra

    Weebarra Level 7

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    I might try it later @frogboy , the first one that @tim one suggested seemed to give a very detailed report (not that i know what any of it means) but i can't figure out how to capture the screen as it has vertical and horizontal scrolling bars and the report is super wide and long, i tried looking online this morning and came across something like grabbit or something but every time i tried to download it, my computer crashed again so i gave up on that. I am pushed for time today (appointments, dinner guests, etc) and then with going away, i might have to leave it until i come back but thanks for your suggestion, i do appreciate that so many people have tried to help me, i just wish i was clever enough to know what i was doing but sadly, i am not :cry:
     
  3. SHvFl

    SHvFl Level 32
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    As it normally happens the bluescreen error is completely useless because MS still thinks that we live in 1990.

    Did you install any new software or updates of software/drivers?
     
  4. frogboy

    frogboy Level 61
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  5. Transhumana

    Transhumana Level 5

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    Were any drivers updated with the latest windows update? :unsure:
    I think it wouldn't hurt to do sfc /scannow as well, to check for possible corruption
     
  6. Weebarra

    Weebarra Level 7

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    Hmmm, the only thing i downloaded was about a week ago was a small folder marker programme and i haven't updated any drivers or such but i did uninstall the bluetooth driver a few days ago. That's the only thing i have done recently other than the software suggested last night to try to analyze the problem.

    @frogboy i have just realised that the utility you linked to is the one that that report has come from, suggested by @Telos . Great minds think alike ;)

    Thanks @Transhumana , i will give that a go in a moment. It's been fine for around an hour so fingers crossed that it was just a blip :)
     
  7. ElectricSheep

    ElectricSheep Level 12

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    It's a weird thing when it blue screens, I've had a few in my time and they just sort of miraculously fix themselves and go away. Never knew what exactly caused them...
     
  8. frogboy

    frogboy Level 61
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    I sure know that feeling, it sure is weird when it happens. o_O;)
     
  9. SHvFl

    SHvFl Level 32
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    If it happens again try and delete the small folder marker program. It might be messing something.
    Also find the bluetooth driver and install it again because windows might have installed the wrong driver for your device and it's messing things up.

    Also first step to do if possible is to change the power plug you are using incase there is a problem with power delivery. Long shot but easy to check so i suggested it.
     
  10. Weebarra

    Weebarra Level 7

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    It sure is, especially when you know nothing about computers :rolleyes:. It happened a couple of years ago but like last night, i just cut the power to it and it has never happened again until last night. My wee laptop is about 6 years old so it maybe it's time it went to laptop heaven. The funny thing is, i was considering being brave and upgrading to W10 but i don't think i'll bother now, it hardly seems worth the bother of giving myself more moments like this.
    [​IMG]

    I will certainly give your suggestions a go @SHvFl , i don't know why i uninstalled the bluetooth, i figured if i didn't use it then it had no place on my pc, lol.
     
  11. Weebarra

    Weebarra Level 7

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    CMD.PNG Nothing untoward here so i will just leave it for now. I have food prep and DG duties to do, 2 tasks i loathe but it preferable to pc problems today. Thanks again folks. I will catch up with your doings later.
     
  12. Opcode

    Opcode Level 18
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    Blue Screen Of Death is always caused by code running in kernel-mode. When hardware is related to the crash, the crash is still caused by code running in kernel-mode AFAIK (although hardware is out of my scope - problem caused because of the hardware issue -> cannot do something properly -> crash).

    I think it is probably caused by buggy code within a driver you have on your system which is of course active, as opposed to hardware. The developer probably made a mistake with the calculations when dealing with memory and this is likely the cause... Maybe it is to do with incorrect variable initialisation though; there can be many things which can lead to this cause. It seems the BugCheck code isn't documented in WDK (Windows Driver Kit) docs although I have never triggered it when developing...

    For example... Memory might be allocated with ExAllocatePool/WithTag and then used a wrong calculation when dealing with the memory so the header for the block was messed up (e.g. maybe when using memcpy with it to copy to the memory or anything similar). -> assuming its related to software and not hardware.

    Since you said this is only a recent thing and a few days ago you did an update for a driver related to Bluetooth, I would advise you to... undo this update if possible. Using outdated drivers is a bad idea as well because driver updates can patch old vulnerabilities/bugs but if the new driver is the cause then reverting should prevent the crash. Try disabling Bluetooth for now in that case, assuming you can do this properly/it will prevent the driver from being used afterwards.

    If it turns out to not be related to the Bluetooth driver then investigation can be pretty troublesome depending on how much software you have installed. The error mentions ntoskrnl.exe (which is the Windows Kernel) but this does not actually mean the bug was caused by Microsoft itself. You see, the device drivers are actually put under ntoskrnl.exe (because unless a device driver is started via a bootkit through something like infection of a Master Boot Record, it will not "truly" be in ring 0 (Kernel-Mode), but actually ring 1 and 2 which is more privileged, and ring 3 is used for normal applications).

    I know this sort of stuff sucks. My old laptop used to have an overheating problem and it would work but after an hour or two it'd be a game from a horror film on when it would "hang up" explorer.exe. It wasn't caused by software, it was hardware related due to me not treating the overheating issue sooner. Every-time it would happen, it would hang up explorer.exe and completely freeze until I hard-shut off the laptop, let it cool down for awhile and then turned it back on.

    My advice would be to try reverting with Bluetooth/disable it for now and see what happens. Do you have any backup images you can use to revert to a previous time, or even a Windows Restore Point? :) If you do decide to just get a new system... Maybe try doing a format and OS re-installation just beforehand to see if that changes anything (and if it still happened then, then it is likely hardware related IMO)

    I really hope you can get this fixed. :)
     
  13. RoboMan

    RoboMan Level 17
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    Usually, BSOD are due to common, easily targeted facts, like:

    1. Driver
    2. Software incompatibility
    3. Broken/corrupt Windows files

    1. Update drivers or uninstall recent drivers that may have broke the system
    2. Uninstall any software that could have damaged the system
    3. Restore the PC to a previous date with no issues, Windows Update or similar could have broken Windows files



    Usually, System Restore can handle this, but there are a few tricks you can do through CMD or even CMD at Recovery CD.
     
  14. frogboy

    frogboy Level 61
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    Maybe the upgrade to Windows 10 will fix all your problems with a new operating system, just make a fresh backup first just in case. ;):)
     
  15. Opcode

    Opcode Level 18
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    It is always because of an error in kernel-mode - and BSOD is exclusive to Windows, other OS may not even have a replication or may have their own sort of error system induced by kernel-mode crashes (OS X have Kernel Panic warning I think). This can be caused by improperly working hardware (now the code executing in kernel-mode can run into an issue it wouldn't have run into if the hardware was in correct condition) or a mistake by the developer.

    If any Windows files are corrupt, as long as it is a user-mode component, no crash would happen (unless specific scenario -> read end of this bit). Crashes in user-mode won't be system-wide because user-mode programs don't have access to all the memory - this is why user-mode is especially important. However, user-mode components improperly working can prevent the OS from working correctly as well (whether crash or not). Also, some user-mode processes in Windows can have a "critical" status to force a BSOD crash if they are terminated (so if they crash as well that counts -> BugCheck detects the termination -> BugCheck CRITICAL_PROCESS_DIED).

    Basically, when a crash happens in kernel-mode, it affects everything system-wide because you can access all the memory. In user-mode however, every application is restricted in the sense it can only access its own memory (by default). When that program crashes, it isn't big enough problem to cause a crash because the only affected memory was the processes' own. Also, Windows uses virtual memory and points it to the real addresses, it handles this all by itself by default. So when you use an address in memory, it will be a virtual memory address -> pointed to the physical address handled by the OS internally (unless you have privileged code via a device driver though -> the mechanism was designed to prevent user-mode applications from having too much control, separating running code so only the code that needs to access/operate hardware components can).

    So anything like a device driver, "critical" user-mode process being terminated (-> kernel-mode detects this via BugCheck which is an internal feature in Windows -> crash - does the same for other things like detection of kernel-mode patching when PatchGuard is present), can cause a BSOD. Hardware issues -> can stop kernel-mode code working correctly -> crash. :)

    I recon that the crash is likely because of the Bluetooth driver update @Weebarra performed a few days ago, though. Who knows.
     
  16. mlnevese

    mlnevese Level 10

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    A quick look with Nirsoft's BlueScreen Viewer could tell us what was loaded at the memory position the crash occurred. That's how I usually solve my random blue screens...

    I still consider exorcism sometimes :)
     
    tim one, bribon77, Weebarra and 7 others like this.
  17. Deletedmessiah

    Deletedmessiah Level 15

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    Is it weird that I never got a single BSOD in my Windows 8.1 laptop which is nearly 5 years old? :LOL: I mean there were many issues but no BSOD like I had with previous Windows.
     
  18. gorblimey

    gorblimey Level 2

    Aug 30, 2017
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    Given the age of your lappy, I'd say the best thing you can do is get a can of compressed air, disassemble the lappy as far as possible and hose out any rubbish around the ventilation slots. Then backup any vital data and replace the lappy. They tell me AlienWare is good stuff.
     
  19. Opcode

    Opcode Level 18
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    Yep :)

    (ntoskrnl.exe base address (because the drivers are under ntoksrnl.exe) + the address from log of the crash) = where the crash probably occurred -> usable to potentially identify the driver responsible

    It isn't indefinite though, it won't be 100% accurate all the time.

    @Weebarra needs to revert or disable that Bluetooth driver and see if it still happens after that if she's up for it (maybe she won't want to do that). If she does want to and can though and the issue still persists, then more options need to be considered for investigation and remedial :)

    Only needs to become complicated if it must :)

    If she cannot disable it properly or revert, and her system is already crashing... She can try doing something like finding the service responsible for the Bluetooth driver, stopping it and then deleting it. She can alter the Properties in case it is set for Boot Start instead of on-demand (also this is enforced via registry so if such settings cannot be changed normally, should work via Registry).

    But just make sure any important stuff is backed up because messing with stuff like this can cause more problems...
     
  20. ElectricSheep

    ElectricSheep Level 12

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    AlienWare is great stuff if you're a gamer, but it's VERY expensive kit too! Not sure if @Weebarra is a gamer either!:eek::p:p
     
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