Industry Aggravated Over Another Botched Windows 10 Upgrade

[overdivine]

more of a hater if you ask me. activism is about political, social , economical changes. windows is not flawless most, software has bugs. let's bash them all. i wonder what you were doing on windows 95/98.
People disable random services, change system registry entries because they've read it somewhere, use old hardware and then complain. I agree that microsoft's support is not the greatest and you usually find the answers elsewhere but considering the number of the devices in question i guess they are doing fine.
Also wanting to make a change and all that you should consider using feedback hub more often and tell your friends about it too.

 

[Burrito]

The Monopoly Formerly Known as Microsoft – Mitchel Lewis – Medium

Ok, after reading this article, I concur that Microsoft and monopolies in general are not good.

I've worked with Microsoft in the business world... and they were a pleasure to work with. Many people would love to work at Microsoft. Bill Gates is a really great human being. I've never minded Windows... and in fact I think we get a decent deal for the amount we pay and the updates we get for many years.

Outside of certain cliques... Microsoft is liked and respected. It has appeared on many lists of "most respected companies" and "most desirable places to work..".

Microsoft has never borked any of my computers. McAfee has... driver-update software has... a lame and faulty hard drive has...

But things would be better if there were more competitors with Microsoft. I think... on this -- most would agree. Generally, choice and competition are good things for consumers.

As the article above indicates... Microsoft is not a 'fair player' in the markets.

People seem to like the Chrome OS. Maybe it will continue to grow.

I guess ultimately... for me, I don't care that much about Microsoft one way or another. I'm actually generally pretty ok with their products. But I do look forward to a day when we have real choices. And I'll consider the Chrome OS next time I purchase a laptop.

 

[Andy Ful]

In reality you do have choices and the decision lies in your hand and those anti-MS faction friends of yours. Why be so frustrated when you can choose to change?

The refusal to change and the constant blaming of others is not going to help you and those anti-MS faction friends of yours.

Please, there are no stupid MT members on this thread. Everyone has the different experience with Windows and has the right to like or dislike M$.
That is simple. There are two kinds of people. Those that were bitten by the dog, and the rest. The first group will not like dogs. Most people in the second group will be dog-neutral or will be sympathetic to the dogs. Also the first group naturally thinks that the percent of the bitten people is graeter than in reality, and the second group is sure that the opposite is true.
That is not the sufficient reason to dislike each other.

 

[overdivine]

I agree that none is stupid here and everybody has his own opinion.
If it were to name one software company that had/has the greatest impact on human evolution what would that be ?

 

[Deleted member 178]

People says "if you don't like Windows, just change", it is more complex than that...

MS fed us since decades, they instilled a way of working and computing. Habits are hard to break

As an individual, changing to another OS, is simple, and cost not much nor gives much hassle except maybe some learning time.

As a company/corporation, it is a bigger issue, changing the OS will force employees to waste time learning it, adapt, change the way they work which reduce the efficiency of the company and its interaction with others who still are on Windows.
I don't even start talking costs and time of deploying the new OS. Time is money.

What i argued about with @HarborFront isn't that he like MS or not or is able to accept and deal with some issues , i honestly don't care. But is that the arguments he used are plausible only from home users/individuals perspective, but are short-sighted when it comes to businesses.

 

[509322]

In reality you do have choices and the decision lies in your hand and those anti-MS faction friends of yours. Why be so frustrated when you can choose to change?

The refusal to change and the constant blaming of others is not going to help you and those anti-MS faction friends of yours.

You really don't know what you're talking about. You have been spouting that same nonsense from the beginning.

If you want to accept Microsoft's Windows garbage that is wonderful for you. If you find it acceptable, then that's great. Most other people do not.

I know all about acceptance. I am an expert in it. I have earned multiple PhDs in Acceptance throughout my life.

You keep making this about people. It has nothing to do with end users. And has everything to do with Microsoft.

It is my job to find out what damage Microsoft has caused with its latest and greatest and let others know about it.

You wouldn't buy a car that is sold without an engine in it. Well that's the same way that a lot of people consider Windows. It doesn't matter that it is software - and that is what you all are not getting. Windows with "known" 20 year bugs is absolutely not acceptable. Software is a product just like any other software. Within the industry there are expectations of reliability and stability.

 

[AriDfoix]

If it were to name one software company that had/has the greatest impact on human evolution what would that be ?

Front Page — Free Software Foundation — working together for free software

 

[509322]

The Monopoly Formerly Known as Microsoft – Mitchel Lewis – Medium

Ok, after reading this article, I concur that Microsoft and monopolies in general are not good.

I've worked with Microsoft in the business world... and they were a pleasure to work with. Many people would love to work at Microsoft. Bill Gates is a really great human being. I've never minded Windows... and in fact I think we get a decent deal for the amount we pay and the updates we get for many years.

Outside of certain cliques... Microsoft is liked and respected. It has appeared on many lists of "most respected companies" and "most desirable places to work..".

Microsoft has never borked any of my computers. McAfee has... driver-update software has... a lame and faulty hard drive has...

But things would be better if there were more competitors with Microsoft. I think... on this -- most would agree. Generally, choice and competition are good things for consumers.

As the article above indicates... Microsoft is not a 'fair player' in the markets.

People seem to like the Chrome OS. Maybe it will continue to grow.

I guess ultimately... for me, I don't care that much about Microsoft one way or another. I'm actually generally pretty ok with their products. But I do look forward to a day when we have real choices. And I'll consider the Chrome OS next time I purchase a laptop.

One on one there are many great people that work for Microsoft.

The business world - Wall Street - they love Microsoft. The studies of "What are the world's most respected companies ?" - those studies are not for IT people, but instead investors and the business world. Hard-working IT people, on limited budgets, with insufficient resources, dealing with Microsoft's needlessly, but fiendishly overly complex products - they generally aren't Microsoft lovers. The people in the trenches - the ones actually using the products - will give you the real truth instead of some paper fantasy.

There's an entire industry that follows and calls Microsoft out. It's been around for decades.

 

[509322]

Please, there are no stupid MT members on this thread. Everyone has the different experience with Windows and has the right to like or dislike M$.
That is simple. There are two kinds of people. Those that were bitten by the dog, and the rest. The first group will not like dogs. Most people in the second group will be dog-neutral or will be sympathetic to the dogs. Also the first group naturally thinks that the percent of the bitten people is graeter than in reality, and the second group is sure that the opposite is true.
That is not the sufficient reason to dislike each other.

It all comes down to money. People who are responsible for people, product, budgets and profits know this. You can't expect someone who has no IT industry experience to know what is really being discussed here.

Buying a car that breaks down at an unaccetably high rate - nobody in their right mind would do it. However, when that car is the only one available on the market, you're stuck buying it. The solution is for people, organizations, and industry to justifiably gang up on that car's manufacturer to get it to change.

The solution is not to sit idly by. You have to do something. You don't just sit there and say "Oh gee... it just is what it is...." You've got to try... otherwise just lay down and allow the product manufacturer to financially butt rape you.

The very same people who think what Microsoft does is acceptable, don't know, they've led a well-protected and sheltered charmed life, but would be "whiners and complainers" too if they had the typical experiences of most ITs.

 

[HarborFront]

You really don't know what you're talking about. You have been spouting that same nonsense from the beginning.

If you want to accept Microsoft's Windows garbage that is wonderful for you. If you find it acceptable, then that's great. Most other people do not.

I know all about acceptance. I am an expert in it. I have earned multiple PhDs in Acceptance throughout my life.

You keep making this about people. It has nothing to do with end users. And has everything to do with Microsoft.

It is my job to find out what damage Microsoft has caused with its latest and greatest and let others know about it.

You wouldn't buy a car that is sold without an engine in it. Well that's the same way that a lot of people consider Windows. It doesn't matter that it is software - and that is what you all are not getting. Windows with "known" 20 year bugs is absolutely not acceptable. Software is a product just like any other software. Within the industry there are expectations of reliability and stability.

You said it right. I know MS OS is a piece of garbage (using your words) but since I'm using it I've learn to live with it and manage it. Period

 

[509322]

You said it right. I know MS OS is a piece of garbage (using your words) but since I'm using it I've learn to live with it and manage it. Period

Maybe I am just damaged.

Windows = PTSD OS.

 

[Deleted member 178]

Personally I like win10, what I dislike is their "unprofessional" behavior, they must fix reported things first then they add new ones if they like.

 

[509322]

Personally I like win10, what I dislike is their "unprofessional" behavior, they must fix reported things first then they add new ones if they like.

My favorite is Windows 8.1. It caused me the least grief. Maybe I will just install Windows 8.1 Enterprise on all my devices and call it a day. Good solution... right ? :X3:

 

[Andy Ful]

Let's make a personal test. Suppose that M$ have said "we decided to make Windows twice better, but also twice more expensive". How many average consumers will think that this decision is good for them?
Probably, more people would like if M$ would decide that the Windows will be twice worse, but also twice cheaper.
M$ has no motivation to make something as solid as Apple products, because this not the winning strategy. Why M$ is a giant with no real competitors? Because they chose the winning strategy.
Who should be blamed that the winning strategy does not prefer solid & secure & expensive products?
Probably Martians.

Demanding from M$ to make the better product for the less money is like demanding from people living in wealthy countries to give 10% of earned money to people from poor countries. That would be ethical and probably the right thing to do. Are we ready?

 

[Burrito]

Personally I like win10, what I dislike is their "unprofessional" behavior, they must fix reported things first then they add new ones if they like.

Exactly. In a relative sense (with no real OS competition) -- I like Win 10 quite a bit.

I know some who got caught up in Win 10 conspiracy theories and stuck with older versions.... and some regret it, and some don't know what they are missing. The older versions don't compare.

 

[Andy Ful]

It all comes down to money. People who are responsible for people, product, budgets and profits know this. You can't expect someone who has no IT industry experience to know what is really being discussed here.

Buying a car that breaks down at an unaccetably high rate - nobody in their right mind would do it. However, when that car is the only one available on the market, you're stuck buying it. The solution is for people, organizations, and industry to justifiably gang up on that car's manufacturer to get it to change.

The solution is not to sit idly by. You have to do something. You don't just sit there and say "Oh gee... it just is what it is...." You've got to try... otherwise just lay down and allow the product manufacturer to financially butt rape you.

The very same people who think what Microsoft does is acceptable, don't know, they've led a well-protected and sheltered charmed life, but would be "whiners and complainers" too if they had the typical experiences of most ITs.

We agree. As I said the 1% of M$ victims should fight in the court. I have no mercy for M$ because the corporate strategy includes the lost cases in the court.

 

[509322]

Let's make a personal test. Suppose that M$ have said "we decided to make Windows twice better, but also twice more expensive". How many average consumers will think that this decision is good for them?
Probably, more people would like if M$ would decide that the Windows will be twice worse, but also twice cheaper.
M$ has no motivation to make something as solid as Apple products, because this not the winning strategy. Why M$ is a giant with no real competitors? Because they chose the winning strategy.
Who should be blamed that the winning strategy does not prefer solid & secure & expensive products?
Probably Martians.

Demanding from M$ to make the better product for the less money is like demanding from people living in wealthy countries to give 10% of earned money to people from poor countries. That would be ethical and probably the right thing to do. Are we ready?

Everything is about money.

"I want perfect Ai\ML Borg Yoda Jedi Mind-Trick Security..."

"OK, pay me... I will make it for you."

"How much ?"

"$10,000,000,000"

PS - I will go by Cylance and have them do it.

 

[ForgottenSeer 72227]

There are many very good points brought up in regards not only to this issue, but how companies in general need to fix things as they are reported first, not focusing on new features first, fix issues later and hope that no one notices. One point I think that really needs to be stressed is to back up, back up, backup. While I agree 100% that Microsoft needs to shoulder 99.9% of the blame for pushing out an update without fixing this issue after it was reported, I do think that individuals need to shoulder an ever so slight blame for not having proper backups. Lets cut the BS here, if all of those people had proper backups of their data, would they actually be this pissed off? I mean sure you would be a little upset and be like what the heck, but knowing you backed up all your data you really wouldn't be that upset. They way I look at it, is that its no different than an HDD dying and or getting hit by a piece of ransomeware. If you have you data backed up you wouldn't stress over these things.

Personally I always do a clean install, never an upgrade as IME it causes more issues than just doing a clean install. I used the media creation tool, backed-up any remaining data and did a clean install of 1809 and guess what, no issues. Granted I know not everyone can do this, especially average computer users, but IMHO, whether you do a clean install, or an in-place upgrade, you should always back up everything just in case, as you never know what could happen.

Again, Microsoft better learn from this lesson and better learn fast, but users in general should always make sure they have backups, as this could happen to anyone, Microsoft, Google, Apple, etc... no one is exempt from this.

 

[voiceofreason]

I can't believe that nobody has figured out that Andy Ful and HarborFront are the same person or bot, likely burrito as well.. and that it's trolling you all to death. The asinine logic of the replies is not due to faulty modes of thought, it's deliberate and intended to be infuriating, heartless and faulty... similar to the behavior of Microsoft itself.

 

[Andy Ful]

I can't believe that nobody has figured out that Andy Ful and HarborFront are the same person or bot, likely burrito as well.. and that it's trolling you all to death. The asinine logic of the replies is not due to faulty modes of thought, it's deliberate and intended to be infuriating, heartless and faulty... similar to the behavior of Microsoft itself.

You caught me. I am certainly Microsoft defender.
I am infuriating and trolling by writing this:
"Please, do not think that I do not respect your point of view. You have the full right to it. It is justified from the ethical point of view. But @HarborFront has also the right to keep his position."
I am also heartless and faulty by writing this:
"That point of view is probably like the below (I added points 3 and 4 as an addition) :

1. Microsoft is not especially ethical corporation, but it should be.
2. Microsoft forces many solutions that people do not like and do not need.
3. Microsoft is selling Windows Home product that has many unnecessary & dangerous features, because M$ guys was lazy and did not bother to remove those features from the system.
4. Microsoft is partially responsible for creation of the complex malware world.
5. Microsoft usually introduces the new features without the sufficient care about stability and security.
6. Microsoft victimizes a lot of people and organizations.
7. Microsoft is no ones friend and it is driven by earning money.
8. There are a lot people that could make the more stable and more secure OS.
9. Microsoft is the only one who should be responsible for Windows faults.

I think that you + most people + me and maybe @HarborFront too, will agree about points 2, 3 ... 8. I also do not like that M$ is not especially ethical.
We probably cannot check the point 1. for the corporations (that is not the same as companies). I believe that there is no ethical corporation in the world. As a corporation I mean the company which can invest a similar amount of money as M$.
I can also agree with the last point."

Or maybe, you did not bother to read all posts in this thread to understand it?

My personal relation to Microsoft is like the relation of the child to the careless and egoistic father.
Other children can hate him, but that does not mean that I must hate him too. And this does not mean also, that I love him.