Kaspersky ban is based on .....

  • Innocent: the US hearings and EU report lacked hard evidence?

    Votes: 40 47.6%
  • uncertain: where there is smoke there is fire,

    Votes: 6 7.1%
  • it is fishy: three is a strike US, UK and EU can't all be wrong

    Votes: 15 17.9%
  • have not made my mind up in this matter

    Votes: 23 27.4%
  • Total voters
    84

shmu26

Level 74
Content Creator
Trusted
Verified
I am running Kaspersky Internet Security 2019 on my main machine, with KSN enabled. I am not a government employee or a politician, so I really could care less about all this nonsense. If you pick your software on political grounds, then you are your own worst enemy.
 

mlnevese

Level 14
Verified
As I said in another thread if you let paranoia rule you, you've better disconnect from the Internet permanently and sell your phones as well. I have no State or Commercial Secrets on my computers and I doubt Kaspersky is selling my pictures in some black market. That kind of behavior would come public sooner or later.

As @Lockdown said what a Government decides to use on their systems is their decision and I understand why the US would be paranoid over Russian or Chinese software on their systems. I bet both Russian and Chinese governments are paranoid about Windows as well. The average user out there is not worth the time and cost of spying on them.
 
5

509322

Does respect really exist? I honestly do not know. I can judge only by their behavior. There were vendors who on the main pages of their sites immediately began to write about the fact that the user should remove Kaspersky AV and and offer to install them AVs.
Or do you mean that marketing and respect of developers are different things and may not overla?. Then yes, maybe so.

Theoretically, you are right, the government always has leverage. But the companies are trying to protect themselves, keeping the money offshore and legally the office is also somewhere there. Therefore, we have some users wonder whether the Kaspersky is a russian company.
I liked your message, it looks like the truth. But so other opinions may be similar to the truth. Probably, the main thing is to take all sides and analyze the information, in order to come yourself to objectivity (or something similar).
In any case, the accusations need evidence.
Respect ? One thing I'm sure of that went away when cavemen first walked out of caves. Kaspersky direct-competitors taking advantage of an opportunity to make a buck in a cut-throat industry ? Opportunistic, cheap shots ? In poor taste ? :X3:

I just tested KIS 2019 three days ago. What the government thinks is necessary, the citizen might think otherwise. And my personal opinion regarding the software has never changed. For a person that wants a full internet security suite, Kaspersky is a really competent choice.

I think there is basis for concern from the perspective of "What could happen," but then things get stupid because a few people are angered, push back, and then things grow well beyond what the original issue was ever about. Disagreements turn into absurdly out-of-control stuff that no one anywhere wants to happen - like walls being built and missile crises. War by AV-proxy...
 

Moonhorse

Level 24
Content Creator
Verified
Living few miles away from russia, and i have always been trusting russia more than us even the border guards of russia arent that friendly :unsure:

When it comes into technology, i really dont care aha:sneaky:
 
Reactions: ZeroDay and upnorth

military

Level 4
Verified
@Lockdown do you think the world will be the same? I understand that he will not be the same. But at least some calm that was about 10 years ago?
History moves in a spiral. But something seems to me that the world (peace) does not even smell.
 
Reactions: bribon77

monkeylove

Level 2
It is a fact china stole info that we didn't give them as far as rocket tech. They are now forming a big friendship with Russia. My grandpa said 60 years ago, one day we would go to war with Russia and China. Don't be deceived. Neither Russia or China are The USA's friends. This new war will be cyber as well as nukes. I just read about a new tech that will make our stelth fighters more imune to cyber attacks , even though, I have no idea why the USA have their fighter and nukes tied to the internet.
If John Pilger is correct in his documentaries, then it was the U.S. that acted aggressively towards the former Soviet Union throughout the Cold War and towards China for more than a century. Given that, the U.S. should also not be trusted.

In which case, and as implied in the article, both the one banned and those banning cannot be trusted.
 
5

509322

@Lockdown do you think the world will be the same? I understand that he will not be the same. But at least some calm that was about 10 years ago?
History moves in a spiral. But something seems to me that the world (peace) does not even smell.
I grew up in the Soviet Era. So, of course, compared to where we were once, things are better now. Not what they should be, but certainly better. The old ways are never forgotten and generations don't really change. 30, 40 years does make a difference, but mankind is flawed because it will repeat its own mistakes over-and-over - accomplish the same unsatisfactory results because it just can't help itself.

I think Eugene had a goal that involved selling to the U.S. government. And that got all messed-up. I think Eugene is a really proud individual - as he should be - and he is taking all of this personally - as I think anyone would. However, one thing I'm sure of is that Eugene Kaspersky will press on in the face of adversity. As long as Eugene and Kaspersky don't do anything stupid, both will eventually come out on-top.

I am much more interested in Kaspersky fixing bugs... I would think the average person prioritizes bug-fixes over politics. Then again, I could very well be wrong about that. Maybe they want their bug-fixes to be political. Such is human nonsense... :X3:
 
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Burrito

Level 9
Kaspersky is a great AV. Probably the best AV.

It comes with a cost.

You'll get periodic searches for 10's of thousands of keywords that Russia is interested in.

And your machine will be a zombie... for possible use in a large conflict.

Since most people don't have classified on their machines... and since it's unlikely that your machine will be activated... the probability that you'll be impacted is low.

But are you willing to take the conditions of the 'deal?'
 
Reactions: Eddie Morra

dabluez98

Level 1
I am sorry but in my view what Umbra says is simplistic and nonsense.

If your concern is that you may be targeted in some ways as a result of being spied upon by security software, this is justified. But if this is your concern, in fact the very products that you should not use are the ones that is under the jurisdiction of the country you are in. For example if you're in the US I would say it's more likely that you will harm yourself by using Bitdefender. Have you guys forgotten about all the unjustified and secret tapping of the US government does on its own citizens? remember, security is not about protecting average Joe - it's about protecting major interests, it's also very much about governments quelling down dissent within their own borders - so if anything you should be more concerned about sticking to absent institutions within the US if you're living in the US because those are the very apps that will collude. If say Kaspersky is spying on you that's bad, but the impacts of that on you will be far less severe than other security apps such as Bitdefender or AOL are spying on you. Again remember Assange and Wikileaks. you have to think about the way the government thinks, you cannot apply your own moral view of the world to geopolitics. This goes to my next point, this home nonsense ( which if you remember Apple also called nonsense because they said there is no evidence to support such a claim that Chinese were implanting spy devices in their products), this will nonsense is more about geopolitics and it's not about individual citizens. It's about countries establishing their power on the world stage. in the way that disconnects to you as a citizen, you should be more scared of your own government, which will take whatever it means to protect its integrity in times of danger - that means violating your rights, just take a look at world history and see whether it was other governments that undermined your rights or the government of the home country of citizens.

I think another point is to really pay careful attention to evidence too - and this is really hard to figure out because you don't know who is making up evidence and who is not. I would most certainly not trust the home government of the country I am in - I within this case trust Kaspersky a bit more.
 

DeepWeb

Level 22
Verified
Definitely phony. Avoiding all software Kaspersky or made in China. Security software from free countries is already suspect. Security software from non-free countries is straight up spyware.
 

Burrito

Level 9
I am sorry but in my view what Umbra says is simplistic and nonsense.

If your concern is that you may be targeted in some ways as a result of being spied upon by security software, this is justified. But if this is your concern, in fact the very products that you should not use are the ones that is under the jurisdiction of the country you are in. For example if you're in the US I would say it's more likely that you will harm yourself by using Bitdefender. Have you guys forgotten about all the unjustified and secret tapping of the US government does on its own citizens? remember, security is not about protecting average Joe - it's about protecting major interests, it's also very much about governments quelling down dissent within their own borders - so if anything you should be more concerned about sticking to absent institutions within the US if you're living in the US because those are the very apps that will collude. If say Kaspersky is spying on you that's bad, but the impacts of that on you will be far less severe than other security apps such as Bitdefender or AOL are spying on you. Again remember Assange and Wikileaks. you have to think about the way the government thinks, you cannot apply your own moral view of the world to geopolitics. This goes to my next point, this home nonsense ( which if you remember Apple also called nonsense because they said there is no evidence to support such a claim that Chinese were implanting spy devices in their products), this will nonsense is more about geopolitics and it's not about individual citizens. It's about countries establishing their power on the world stage. in the way that disconnects to you as a citizen, you should be more scared of your own government, which will take whatever it means to protect its integrity in times of danger - that means violating your rights, just take a look at world history and see whether it was other governments that undermined your rights or the government of the home country of citizens.

I think another point is to really pay careful attention to evidence too - and this is really hard to figure out because you don't know who is making up evidence and who is not. I would most certainly not trust the home government of the country I am in - I within this case trust Kaspersky a bit more.
Bitdefender is a Romanian company.
 

Slyguy

Level 40
Have you guys forgotten about all the unjustified and secret tapping of the US government does on its own citizens? remember, security is not about protecting average Joe - it's about protecting major interests, it's also very much about governments quelling down dissent within their own borders - so if anything you should be more concerned about sticking to absent institutions within the US if you're living in the US because those are the very apps that will collude.
Here's the thing. US Citizens have immense protection within the USA, not just the US Constitution, but also state constitutions and local/regional laws/regulations. Let's assume there is spying going on internally, so what? They can't do anything with the data or they risk exposure of methods and sources, and in the vast majority of cases exposure would also mean liability since they didn't follow the requirements of the law. So let's say DISA or the NSA snags a list of your installed programs and documents. By law, they are required to have a warrant to gather this. If it was gathered due to a 'technical' issue, they are required to delete it. It can't be used as actionable intelligence whatsoever, period.

The golden rule for US Citizens is - you can basically do anything you want as long as you don't A) Threaten others. B) Threaten yourself. Barring those two things, American's have virtually unlimited freedom to do as they please. Even if you go insane, run out and wave, scream and act like a fool or claim you are Jesus Christ or aliens abducted you, nobody can do anything about it. Even if the LE arrests you under the baker act or 5150 you CANNOT be held over 72 hours provided you do not threaten to harm others, or yourself. Even if a psychiatrist says you are absolutely NUTS.

The reality is most likely this - for US Citizens, using a US Based antivirus product is probably your best bet because it activates not only the constitutional protections, but consumer protection laws. Norton isn't going to risk their bottom line spying on you, and the big boys have other methods to get what they need anyway.
 

dabluez98

Level 1
I agree with you Slyguy, but that's in theory what most governments around the world do or say, democratic non-democratic.. but when push comes to shove you are in trouble. also if what you say is true do you realize if it wasn't for hacker US government would be spying on US citizens immensely still, (i think they still are but they got called out on it by hackers, wiki, and others. the constitution remeber is a piece of paper and its not all determining of everything..not trying to make a light of the constittuion but it's not all powerful or at least outcome determining necessarily.
 

Burrito

Level 9
Here's the thing. US Citizens have immense protection within the USA, not just the US Constitution, but also state constitutions and local/regional laws/regulations. Let's assume there is spying going on internally, so what? They can't do anything with the data or they risk exposure of methods and sources, and in the vast majority of cases exposure would also mean liability since they didn't follow the requirements of the law. So let's say DISA or the NSA snags a list of your installed programs and documents. By law, they are required to have a warrant to gather this. If it was gathered due to a 'technical' issue, they are required to delete it. It can't be used as actionable intelligence whatsoever, period.

The golden rule for US Citizens is - you can basically do anything you want as long as you don't A) Threaten others. B) Threaten yourself. Barring those two things, American's have virtually unlimited freedom to do as they please. Even if you go insane, run out and wave, scream and act like a fool or claim you are Jesus Christ or aliens abducted you, nobody can do anything about it. Even if the LE arrests you under the baker act or 5150 you CANNOT be held over 72 hours provided you do not threaten to harm others, or yourself. Even if a psychiatrist says you are absolutely NUTS.

The reality is most likely this - for US Citizens, using a US Based antivirus product is probably your best bet because it activates not only the constitutional protections, but consumer protection laws. Norton isn't going to risk their bottom line spying on you, and the big boys have other methods to get what they need anyway.

Wow Sly.... that's good. You pretty well nailed it.
 
Reactions: oldschool

oldschool

Level 23
Verified
Here's the thing. US Citizens have immense protection within the USA, not just the US Constitution, but also state constitutions and local/regional laws/regulations. Let's assume there is spying going on internally, so what? They can't do anything with the data or they risk exposure of methods and sources, and in the vast majority of cases exposure would also mean liability since they didn't follow the requirements of the law. So let's say DISA or the NSA snags a list of your installed programs and documents. By law, they are required to have a warrant to gather this. If it was gathered due to a 'technical' issue, they are required to delete it. It can't be used as actionable intelligence whatsoever, period.

The golden rule for US Citizens is - you can basically do anything you want as long as you don't A) Threaten others. B) Threaten yourself. Barring those two things, American's have virtually unlimited freedom to do as they please. Even if you go insane, run out and wave, scream and act like a fool or claim you are Jesus Christ or aliens abducted you, nobody can do anything about it. Even if the LE arrests you under the baker act or 5150 you CANNOT be held over 72 hours provided you do not threaten to harm others, or yourself. Even if a psychiatrist says you are absolutely NUTS.

The reality is most likely this - for US Citizens, using a US Based antivirus product is probably your best bet because it activates not only the constitutional protections, but consumer protection laws. Norton isn't going to risk their bottom line spying on you, and the big boys have other methods to get what they need anyway.
You forgot the most important one: C. You absolutely cannot challenge the power of the state, politicians and their corporate overlords! Other than that, you're correct. An American is free to remain as ignorant and as passive as he likes. :whistle::whistle::whistle::barefoot::barefoot::barefoot: